Arizona Cardinals Open Draft Thread
by Bezekira on Nov 2, 2009 11:22 AM MST
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PrintBad, Disappointing, Disgusting loss = Don't want to talk about it
I know I'm not the only one out there who'd rather just sweep yesterday's patchetic showing by the Cardinals under the rug and move on. With that in mind (and since we haven't had a draft thread in a while), I thought we could talk a little NFL draft......
(And no this doesn't mean that I'm giving up on the season or don't think we're playoff bound, I'd just rather focus on something else right now (call it a rebound-topic)).
Needs (IMO, in no particular order):
Offensive Tackle: First, Mike Gandy will be a free agent after this season so they'll have to decide if he's worth resigning and there's always the talk of Levi Brown (hopefully) moving to guard. Either way you look at this an upgrade is needed at the tackle position very soon.
Inside Linebacker: The big question here is Karlos Dansby. If he stays then there's no need and we move on. If he leaves (as expected) this might just be the biggest need heading into the draft.
Outside Linebacker: Chike Okeafor is a free agent after this season and Clark Haggans isn't exactly a force as a pass rusher. Hopefully Cody Brown can step into one starting spot next year but we need another bona-fide pass rusher to groom on the other side, if not a guy who can start immediately.
Nose Tackle: The big question here is Gabe Watson. If he's a future starter at nose tackle then the need is dimished a great deal but so far the big man hasn't wrestled the starting job away from veteran Bryan Robinson and he's registered a grand total of nine tackles in seven games.
Offensive Guard: While I won't pretend to make you guys think that I'm breaking down game tape of the offensive line, especially the interior line, I think it's fairly obvious to most that the offensive line is one of the weak spots of this team. It might take an incredible value for them to use an early round pick on a guard but I think it's possible.
Guys who interest me (again in no particular order):
- Jerry Hughes (6-3, 257): You know that one guy every year that you fall in love with and desperately hope your team drafts....meet my man crush of 2090-2010. Hughes, a defensive end from TCU, was among the nation's leaders in sacks (15), tackles for loss (19.5) and forced fumbles (6) last season and he's wreaking havoc again this year (nine sacks through eight games). The former running back is a quick off the ball and can obviously move in space. The best news is that he's only been on the defensive side of the ball for four years so he's still getting better. Projected Round: Late 1st - Mid 2nd
- Brandon Spikes or Rolando McClain (6-3, 256 & 6-4, 248): If you're looking for Karlos Dansby's replacement in the first round, look no further than either of these two guys. Spikes might have been the first ILB drafted last season if he'd have come out but he chose to return to Florida and despite an injury that's caused him to miss 2 1/2 games he's doing solid work again this year. McClain already plays in a 3-4 at Alabama so he might be a better fit for Arizona and he's more athletic than Spikes. Both are very productive and could be day one starters.
- Phil Taylor (6-4, 355): If he choose's to come out, Taylor could be a mid-round option with the potential to grow into a future starting nose tackle. The big man transferred from Penn State to Baylor and has had a decent season even though some expected quite a bit more from him. He still leads the Baylor defense in QB hurries and has blocked two kicks which is impressive considering he's basically a space eater.
Ok your turn......what are the Cardinals biggest draft needs? What players have caught your eye so far?
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Revenge of the Birds' (ROTB) editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of ROTB's editors.
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I really like Jerry Hughes, the guy is a beast.
I have gotten to watch a few games with TCU playing this year and he was pretty explosive and quick around the corners. He would definitely be a welcomed addition to the Cardinals OLB / DE unit.
However if either McClain of Spikes is available when we are picking I think I would go with them if Dansby is not here next year, which is likely what will happen. We have little depth behind Dansby and Hayes so I think that is where we have to go and possibly go OLB or OT in 2nd round.
yea I agree....if Spikes or McClain are there when we pick in round 1, they're the right choice
That’s one of the reasons my love for Hughes is a bit crazy. Ideally I’d like to see them trade up for Hughes I guess….maybe Alan Branch style.
Be careful....to a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
I would like them to do tha also but I doubt they will.
Next years draft is expected to be one of the deepest drafts we have had in awhile. I guess with all the talk of adding a rookie wage scale to the CBA that a lot of the draft eligible players this year are going to come out of college and try and get their money before that happens.
Damn this is the part where I wish I actually watched college football.
What? I didn't break it, I was just testing its durability, and then I placed it in the woods becuase it's made out of wood and I just thought he should be with his family.
Revenge of the Birds
Well I do watch it and like I said last year...
I would love Terrence Cody from Alabama. They already play a 3-4 and he is a monster at 6’5’’ and down to about 350lbs. But you can’t deny that Gandy sucks in pass pro (against speedy ends) and Levi sucks at tackle (against anyone on the other side of the ball). I doubt Gandy is resigned and I still believe Levi would be a better guard. I think his inline blocking is acceptable but not sure how his speed is when pulling. We could possibly have two new starters at tackle next year. ILB has been discussed and I can admit when I’m wrong. KD would be missed. We have noone who could step in and start right away. My last two are QB and WR. BSP will be gone (imo) and Kurt might not last another full season. Q has been almost too model of a citizen. Makes me wonder what was promised to him as far as another extension or a trade. I still feel good about our young OLBs but agree we desparately need depth behind them. Will Davis will be a better pro than Cody Brown. I said before the season and I’ll stick to it. With basically a full year over the injured Brown I think this year will help him assimilate to the position quicker.
Life's too short. Be a fan. Orlando Magic, Arizona Cardinals,Tampa Bay Rays and of course "the U"! What a winning combo.
Either way, getting Cody Brown will be a big gain next year.
What? I didn't break it, I was just testing its durability, and then I placed it in the woods becuase it's made out of wood and I just thought he should be with his family.
Revenge of the Birds
Love me some Cody as well
It would take a first round pick to get him though and I think we’ve got other pressing needs.
I like Will Davis but we don’t have anything other than blind hope that either he or Cody Brown will become above average OLB’s.
Be careful....to a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
Not a Cody Fan
He probably will go 1st round just because of his size, but the more I watch Cody the more I think he is a 2nd round talent and it wouldn’t surprise me if he falls on draft day. He fails to dominate too often and he is over weight and therefore burns out. I wouldn’t burn a 1st round on Cody.
MBN
by mbn on Nov 4, 2009 4:57 PM MST up reply actions
Cody
isn’t my favorite either for a NT. He is a 2 down player at best and will need to be more than just a big man in the NFL. He needs to lose a bit more weight and gain some speed. He is quite limited to what he can do overall.
almost all true NT are two down players
Casey Hampton rarely plays on passing downs but he’s still considered a top thee NT. It’s just the nature of the beast. They have to be big enough to command double teams and strong enough not to lose ground while doing so. I see that ability when I watch Cody.
Be careful....to a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
Thank you!!
Being a pass rush specialist is a plus for a 3-4 NT. His main priority is to occupy 2 blockers to free up one of the ILBs. Plain and simple.
Life's too short. Be a fan. Orlando Magic, Arizona Cardinals,Tampa Bay Rays and of course "the U"! What a winning combo.
I
think everything for the first round depends on keeping Dansby. If Dansby stays then I would take a look at another DE/OLB or OT. If Dansby goes then I am looking at a new ILB. I am leaning towards defense and they shift the O-line around with guys already there after removing Gandy. I like Sean Weatherspoon at OLB, Greg Hardy at DE/OLB, and Rolando McClain at ILB. They are all aggressive and athletic players. Then they need a NT for a true 3-4 line, SS/FS depending on what Ware or Rolle does, depth at ILB/OLB, and QB for depth or the future. The WR spot could change too if Boldin does get to leave.
OLB's
Weatherspoon – Most people consider him strictly a 4-3 OLB mainly because of his size (6-1, 235).
Hardy – I liked Hardy but when I asked some draft-niks about him they said he was too stiff to move to OLB and that he should be considered only as a 4-3 DE. He’s almost the exact size of LaMarr Woodley though so we’ll see how he performs in agility drills at the combine.
McClain – I absolutely love that guy. He can do it all and he’s already got experience in the 3-4. If he’s on the board when we go on the clock, I’ll be praying that he’s the pick.
Eric Norwood (6-1, 252) – Norwood is considered by some to be the #1 3-4 OLB prospect in the county (yes even better than Sergio Kindle). He’s already playing OLB in South Carolina’s system and he’s already got over 50 tackles, 8.5 tackles for loss, six sacks and two picks. I doubt he’ll be around when the Cards pick but him and Sergio Kindle are #1 and #2 in the OLB rankings.
Be careful....to a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
OLB
Weatherspoon: Agreed- he is not worth a 1st round as an OLB.
Hardy: Agreed
Norwood: he may well be the best value in the draft and could likely be in the bottom 3rd of the 1st round. I like his potential.
Hughes is worth a late 1st round pick but I don’t think he will fall that far.
Some others worth watching:
Everson Griffen (USC) He is big 270 ish (depending on where you read) but he is an athlete and plays an OLB when USC goes to a 3-4 front. If he comes out he has the potential of becoming a Suggs like player. he has the potential to dominate the game.
Jermaine Cunningham, Florida 6-3. 250. He is a solid late 1st round pick. He may slip to early 2nd but I doubt it.
Brandon Lang Troy 6-3½, 255, based on his combine I wouldn’t be surprised to see his stock rises as we approach the draft.
Greg Romeus, Pittsburgh 6-5. 265, If he comes out and has a good combine he could be a beast at OLB and might go 1st round.
Sergio Kindle, Texas 6-4. 254, Right now I have him falling all the way to mid to late 2nd round. despite the early hype, he has shown me nothing.
George Selvie, South Florida 6-4. 250, Have to see if he can play with his hand off the ground. Mid to late 2nd round.
Antonio Coleman, (Auburn 6-2. 250), and Auston English, (Oklahoma 6-3. 255) could also be some 2-4 round options.
MBN
by mbn on Nov 4, 2009 5:14 PM MST up reply actions
Weatherspoon
can play OLB in a 3-4. He is a playmaker and possesses the best qualities for a linebacker. He is found all over the field and never gives up. So I would never rule him out and he will be taken in the first round.
Hardy will be good if he can stay healthy. Most “draftniks” don’t ever get it right anyways. He has said in interviews he is versatile and would play ILB and OLB if given the chance.
ILB in 1st round???
I always wrestle with picking an ILB in the 1st round especially in a 3-4. McClain and Spikes are talented however, and there are not many bigger ILB in the draft. Ezeh (Michigan 6-2. 247) and Johnson (Kentucky 6-2. 254) are two mid round possibilities that I have been watching.
MBN
by mbn on Nov 4, 2009 5:01 PM MST up reply actions
I see what you did there
Clever
What? I didn't break it, I was just testing its durability, and then I placed it in the woods becuase it's made out of wood and I just thought he should be with his family.
Revenge of the Birds
I say just about anyone other than the 31 guys drafted before that point
Be careful....to a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
If I had to imagine what the Cardinals would target it would be
LB, OT, TE, DT, but mostly LB
What? I didn't break it, I was just testing its durability, and then I placed it in the woods becuase it's made out of wood and I just thought he should be with his family.
Revenge of the Birds
Yup
I see going after a C before another G. We have Sendlein, who was sub-par last year, and a wash of guys who could maybe possibly fill in for a little while because they did it once in high school…
Agree that LB is the biggest concern, followed by OT and DT. I seriously doubt we use a high pick on a TE. Patrick is cool. Secondary — specifically safety, what with RJ being inactive all the time, and Brown, Ware, and Rolle questionable for the future — seems like a key spot to address again.
So:
LB > DT > OT > S > C > QB
Maybe bring in a late WR and/or TE, or double up on one of the above positions.
Order of draft
In the 1st round based on starting talent: .
1- OT If any of the 3-5 top level tackles are available I think I would look there first. OLB will still be available in 2nd round.
2- OLB Assuming the top OT are gone (which I assume they will be) then take the starting quality of OLB
3- ILB Only if MCClain or Spikes are available, otherwise wait.
4- S If Berry or Mayes are there it would be very hard to pass
I think OLB is most likely
I wouldn’t be concerned with Center or Guard except in the late rounds. Not a talented Center draft (not obvious upgrade over Sendelin or Claxton) and we have two potential guards waiting in the wings in Keith and Johnson.
MBN
by mbn on Nov 4, 2009 5:26 PM MST up reply actions
Yeah, that was my thinking on the C/G positions, as well
As others have said, it depends a lot on who we retain. The more I see of our offensive production, the more I think I should have put OT higher.
LB and DT are still pretty close in terms of need. I’m okay with Watson & B-Rob now, but I’m not comfortable with the future outlook of the position. Similarly, I’m trying to envision a defensive season with Hayes & Highsmith starting at ILB… Probably not that bad, but not exactly great, either. Highsmith needs to show he can stay healthy!
The only thing that might keep us from taking OLB first would be Cody Brown. We spent a 2nd rounder on the kid, and as we’ve seen with Alan Branch, Whiz is okay with waiting on picks to come around.
Agree on Brown and Highsmith
Brown’s development will have a big impact. The only problem is that we don’t know. It will be like we drafted him all over again in 2010. I use Highsmith as my standard in drafting an ILB. If I think the ILB would be an obvious improvement over Highsmith then I am interested but if it isn’t clear then I wouldn’t draft that position in the first few rounds.
MBN
by mbn on Nov 5, 2009 1:54 PM MST up reply actions
you had me at draft
Mclain oh happy days then a ot for gandy then move over and get a nt from bama or south carolina. Then olb but I can see us going ilb then olb
The Devil Birds just got cha
by DaCards on Nov 3, 2009 9:41 PM MST via mobile reply actions
Agreed.
The problem any LT rookie will have with the Cards is how we frequently sit the LT on an island against speed rushers and any rookie LT would be in trouble. To start a rookie LT wouldn’t immediately upgrade the OL but it might over time if we chip with a TE frequently. Here are some LT that I have been watching.
Possible first round:
Trent Williams, Ok 6-4, 305
Russel Okung OK St. 6’4’ 300
Bryan Bulaga, Iowa 6-6. 305 (if he comes out)
Charles Brown, USC 6-6. 296 (I think he has a big upside if he gets stronger)
Anthony Davis, Rutgers 6-6. 335 (If he comes out early.)
Ed Wang, Virginia Tech 6-5. 309 (could be a 2nd round possibility)
Zane Beadles, Utah 6-4. 312 (His combine will hopefully show some footwork)
Kyle Calloway Iowa 6-6½, 318 (might be a better RT but has athleticism so maybe LT)
Tony Washington Abilene Christian 6-6, 305 (Has great upside but not ready to start)
Matt Kopa Stanford 6-4½, 305 (also has potential)
MBN
by mbn on Nov 5, 2009 2:05 PM MST up reply actions
I like Bulaga
He is a beast plus he’s a smart kid. If he comes out (he is a true junior this year) I would be all over him.
Plus he looks a little like an XXXLT version of coach whiz http://www.hawkeyesports.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/bulaga_bryan00.html.
by Drullin'OverDaCards on Nov 5, 2009 3:56 PM MST up reply actions
lol
What? I didn't break it, I was just testing its durability, and then I placed it in the woods becuase it's made out of wood and I just thought he should be with his family.
Revenge of the Birds
RT Options
Another thought is that the Cards will flip L. Brown to the LT and then seek a RT in the draft or use Keith or Johnson which I think they will do after this year. The upside in drafting a RT is that usually they can be had later in the draft at a better price. Along with the LT I listed previously in the thread, here are some RT options. Many of them are LT now but will be RT in the NFL.
Adam Ulatoski, Texas 6-8. 310 Could play LT but stronger at RT.
Matt Reynolds, BYU 6-6. 320 if he comes out he is versatile and can play multiple positions.
Sam Young, Notre Dame 6-7. 318 I like his effort but is average talent
Ciron Black, LSU 6-5. 315 His stock is fallen but I still think he can play RT in the NFL
Dennis Landolt, Penn State 6-4. 310 Anyone up for another PSU tackle? Might be better than Brown.
Chris Scott Tennessee 6-4½, 320 Could potential play LT as well
Tray Allen, Texas 6-5. 320 He may not come out early.
MBN
Brown at tackle is a bad idea no matter what side he's on.
Especially Warner’s blind side if he’s still starting.
What? I didn't break it, I was just testing its durability, and then I placed it in the woods becuase it's made out of wood and I just thought he should be with his family.
Revenge of the Birds
Yeah, but for next year...
are we drafting a LT for Kurt’s blind side or a RT for Matt’s blind side. With Kurt’s contract set up the way it is, he may not be our starter next year. Matt is a lefty which changes everything.
Life's too short. Be a fan. Orlando Magic, Arizona Cardinals,Tampa Bay Rays and of course "the U"! What a winning combo.
Yeah so either way we're screwed if we keep Levi Brown starting.
I’d say decide the quarterback situation before the draft.
What? I didn't break it, I was just testing its durability, and then I placed it in the woods becuase it's made out of wood and I just thought he should be with his family.
Revenge of the Birds
levi & leinart
Can you really call them a bust I don’t really think so
The Devil Birds just got cha
by DaCards on Nov 7, 2009 9:14 AM MST via mobile up reply actions
So far Leinart has not had enough chances to really tell what we have in him.
With Levi, it might be a little premature to call him a bust but he sure has not played like he was a top ten pick in the 2007 draft.
I think the time for "drafting for Warner" is over
At the most he’s the starter through next season but drafting a guy that fit’s his “system” or style of play seems very short-sighted.
Be careful....to a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
as long as we dont have a wadsworth or wendle bryant again ill be happy
The Devil Birds just got cha
by DaCards on Nov 7, 2009 3:45 PM MST via mobile up reply actions
Draft a QB
After seeing what Leinart brought to the table today, I’m not too comfortable putting our team into his hands….
Ok maybe I am being too harsh...
I agree that one pass isn’t enough to really evaluate how good Leinart is now. But, Leinart has never been a player I’ve trusted entirely out there. And too see him go out there and toss that ball right to the defender didn’t inspire confidence.
I really honestly was hoping he’d go out there and do well in mop up duty. (I’m not just some Leinart hater) =)
Yeah, it was disappointing
But his body of work for us is bigger than that ;)
And actually, I fully agree that we should draft a QB. BSP can go anytime, Warner will be gone after next year, and then we’ll only have Leinart, who isn’t exactly a spring chicken anymore. It’s a great time to infuse the position with some youth regardless of whether or not we think Leinart is the guy.
1st and 2nd round picks should go towards ILB and OT.
No doubt about it. We’ll need a big playmaker @ ILB to replace Dansby if he leaves (which is likely), so I would rather they go ILB 1st round unless there’s a Michael Oher type OT (did you see how he handled Jared Allen!?) left. But on the other hand we can still get a good OT in the 2nd and have him compete with Kieth and Johnson for a starting spot, and go for Brandon Spikes in the 1st round. The rest of the picks they’ll just draft for depth at LB, CB, S, and hopefully QB and a WR.
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