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Did the Cardinals Make the Right pick in Rashad Johnson and Greg Toler?

The day before the 2009 draft I was completely, overwhelmingly, unflinchingly confident that the Cardinals would not draft any secondary. I would have bet money, (if I was a betting man), that there was no chance the Cards would pick up a corner or a safety. It just didn't make sense. There were at least 2 key reasons that I had for concluding they would never draft a safety or corner in 2009.

1-No Team Need:
I am a believer in drafting the best player available, but the best-player-available approach is filtered through the lens of team needs. Cody Brown is a classic example. After picking up a highly graded running back in Chris Wells, the Cardinals still needed to improve their pass rush through an outside linebacker. Although we don't know what grade the Cardinals had given individual players, most draft boards had graded Cody Brown in the late 50s or early 60s. There were likely others still on the Cardinals board that were graded higher than C. Brown but team needs affected the pick. C. Brown was not a reach but neither was he the highest graded player still on the board. Not a reach but not a value pick either. He was the best player of need that was worthy of the 63rd pick.

In the months leading up to the draft the Cardinals had strengthened their secondary to the point where it had become one of the strongest positions on the team, arguably, second only to receivers. The addition of Bryant McFadden from Pittsburgh and Keith Lewis from San Francisco had considerably ungraded the secondary. Suddenly, the Cardinals had DRC and McFadden as the Corners, and Hood as the nickel back. Lewis added depth to the safety position. It seemed like a waste of a draft pick to select a safety or a corner.

 

Star-divide

2-Poor Draft for Secondary:
In my unprofessional opinion, the 2009 draft was one of the worst for corners and safeties in a long time. Other experts had drawn the same conclusion. Most corners who were invited to the combine were considered more of a safety than a corner. They were slow and small. Add to that a large cadre of mediocre safeties and the secondary class of 2009 failed to inspire excitement for finding a future impact player. The history of the draft seems to underscore the weakness of the 2009 class of safeties and corners.

2006: 5 out of 40 corners drafted were taken in the first round.
           2 out of 9 safeties drafted were taken in the first round.
2007: 4 out of 38 corners drafted were taken in the first round.
           3 out of 14 safeties drafted were taken in the first round.
2008: 5 out of 30 corners drafted were taken in the first round.
           1 out of 12 safeties drafted were taken in the first round.

However in 2009:
             2 corners out of 39 were taken in the first round, (Malcolm Jenkins and Vonte Davis), and there is suspicion among several that these two may end up as safeties. 18 corners were drafted before Greg Toler was taken by the Cardinals with their 127th pick.

             0 safeties out of 18 were drafted in the first round. Only 4 safeties were drafted before the Cardinals selected Rashad Johnson with their 95th pick.

I will confess that I had never heard of Toler before the draft nor was I overly familiar with R. Johnson. That was by design. I had long concluded that there would be no corners or safeties drafted by the Cardinals so I didn't spend much time looking in detail at players at this position.

Were Rashad Johnson and Greg Toler the right pick?
Now that the draft is over I clearly was wrong about the Cardinals not drafting secondary, I have gone back and looked at these two players and have been impressed. In both cases I am surprised that they were still available when the Cards drafted them. Their skills and credentials are impressive. Johnson is impressive and seems to be the ball-hawk center-fielder that the Cards have needed for a while. The recent interview of Rashad Johnson by Hawkwind (posted on ROTB) underscores the caliber of individual he is and his potential capability on the field. That he has return skills is a bonus.

Toler does not have the same credentials as Johnson but as was recently noted on Cardinals Underground, he has the skills, build, and perspective that is light years ahead of the small school he attended. It has been speculated that had he been more studious in high school he could have been playing at a major university. He appears to be the real deal and from all indications may be a future started. Remember McFadden was only signed for two years, just enough time to prepare a young corner from St Pauls in Virginia.

Time will tell what will become of these two but it looks promising.

So both picks appear promising, but were they the best picks? The right picks? With depth at inside linebacker, defensive line, and center still a concern and lingering questions about the future of tight end, should the Cards have gone in another direction? Just to fuel the discussion I went back and looked at a few of those who were still available at their 95th and 127th picks respectively. It should be noted that this was also a bad draft class for defensive line, especially after the second round, however, is was a relatively solid draft for ILB, especially in the middle rounds.

When Rashad Johnson was picked the following were available: Luigs (Center 6'4" 301), V. Martin (NT. 6'3" 331), S. L. Hill (NT. 6'4" 329), A. Hill (TE 6'5" 262), and Sidbury (OLB 6'2" 266). I might have been tempted to take any one of these players ahead of Johnson, especially the 2 N.T. given the team's 3-4 defensive line needs. However, if Branch improves and one of the gaggle of TEs steps up then all is well.

When Greg Toler was picked the following were available: S. McKillop (ILB 6'1" 244lb), J. Brinkley (ILB 6'2" 252lb), and C. Ingram (TE 6'4" 245)Did The Cardinals Make The Right Pick with Rashad Johnson and Greg Toler?. I Like Brinkley and had him coming to the Cards in the 4th round in my mock draft so I am a little bias here. I know good corners are always in demand, yet with there being a good chance that Dansby will not be back next year I would have been temped to find a possible heir-apparent in the draft. Maybe none of these potential ILB were not deemed quality enough to start someday so why not take a potential future starter in Toler? I guess that makes sense.

As with all drafts, time will tell. But at first blush, and given who the Cards did not pick, do you think the Cards made the right choice? Did they find two gems in a draft full of secondary duds? Will the team be better with these two players verses other options they might have drafted? Training camp will start to show us if these two will measure up. If they are starters in a couple of years- great, but if Vaughn Martin becomes a beast in a year or two and Johnson remains only a special teams player then we all will start with the "what ifs". I.e. what if we had drafted Adrian Peterson instead of Levi Brown...

 

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Revenge of the Birds' (ROTB) editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of ROTB's editors.

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I think they did

As the draft unfolded I was surprised as well because I didn’t think we’d take but maybe one defensive back, so when we went back to back in rounds 3 & 4 I was wondering if that was the way to go, and in hindsight I think it was.

In the third round I was really hoping that Kraig Urbik would fall but when the Steelers took him I don’t think we had any choice but to go with Johnson at that point because he really should have been gone a round earlier. I don’t know when Rolle’s contract is up but the Cards were thinking ahead with Antonio Smith when they picked Campbell and Iwebema the year before, and I think that Johnson really looks like a potential starter in this league so I’d rather they go that route than to reach.

Round 4 shocked me, I wasn’t thinking CB at all. But again, I’m not as high on Ingram as some (I was thinking a TE at this point, and if I remember correctly Buffalo ruined that by taking Shawn Nelson). Ingram is another guy who still needs to learn how to block and we have enough of that on our roster already. The guys you mentioned I think will be good backups, but if what I’ve read about Toler is true the opportunity to get a legit starter at this point in the draft had to be too appealing to pass up, even if the need isn’t there right now. Of course, not to jinx anyone but injuries could speed the process along as well.

I’ve got to give our current leadership the benefit of the doubt because their personnel moves have been more right than wrong, and we’ve suffered through enough bad regimes to know that this group has a definite plan in place.

by Long Beach on May 14, 2009 3:56 PM MDT reply actions  

I think we got the RIGHT players.

1. If I’m not mistaken, Rolle has an ascending (back loaded) contract. This was signed knowing that there was no way that we’d see the final year of it. If we are unable to resign him, then we will already have the heir apparant in the wings with a year in the system. RJ is no doubt the ballhawking center fielder we have coveted for years now and should be ready to slide right in if Rolle is gone, at a much cheaper rate as well for possibly much more production.

2. $5mil a year for a CB is much too much to pay for a corner, but in a win now and win later approach, we had to fix a glaring weakness. We got burned for so many passing TDs last year that a drastic change was necessary. We compensated for some of his costs by cutting Hood. In the grande scheme of things, the bottom line is the bottom line. Hence Mac’s contract only being for 2 years. I have to applaud the FO for this. They drafted Toler (a guy many have repeatedly said looks to be a clone of DRC) and he can sit for up 2 years before he is asked to start. And don’t get me wrong. We will save a ton when he is starting and Mac is gone. Another cost cutting move. Genius.

3. My only concern is that we didn’t get anyone to play in the middle of our 3-4. With KD most likely bolting after the season, We will have a huge void. But maybe, just maybe we already have a secret weapon in the waiting, for the cheap I might add.

4. Which leads me to my last point. Go Cards! Enough said.

by hevchv on May 14, 2009 5:27 PM MDT reply actions  

interesting thoughts and I think the Cards certainly surprised us all

I thought the Cards would address the secondary but I didn’t think that a corner would be drafted unless they had serious return potential. Looking back at my mock draft, I had them taking a safety in the fifth round so I thought they needed some depth at safety. One guy that I think some of us my be is Keith Lewis. Everything that I’ve read and heard on the guy suggests that he’s a special teamer first and really shouldn’t be counted on from the defensive side. I know that Bill Davis has some experience with Lewis so there’s a glimmer of hope that he can help Lewis get back to his 2006 form, but even at his best, Lewis is a strong safety in the cheap-knockoff mold of A-dub. We did need a ‘centerfield-type’ safety that would allow A-dub to roam and the corners to be aggressive without have to worry about getting beaten over the top. So far, Rashad Johnson sounds like that guy. With all that being said, do I really agree with the picks……

2nd round: I obviously liked Lawrence Sidbury (I had the Cards taking him in the second), but I guess the scouting reporting didn’t match up to what the NFL teams thought of him. He lasted until late in the fourth round while guys like David Veikume (who we all thought was a 4th or 5th round guy) went in the second. Overall though, I like the pick of Brown and it sounds like the staff really thinks he can contribute right away, which is rare for DE/OLB convert. So I can’t argue with the pick…thumbs up Cards!!

3rd Round: I had the Cards taking a G/T from Eastern Michigan (who was avaliable and was actually selected about 10 picks later) and I had them taking a safety in the fifth, but of course we know that ended up getting our G/T guy in the fifth and we took Rashad in the third. So my illogical mind says, would you rather have TJ Lang and Brandon Underwood or Rashad Johnson and Big Herman Johnson? I’m thinking the Double Johnson (can you tell I like nicknames) is the better combo. So I can’t argue with the pick….thumbs up Cards!!

4th Round: I had the Cards taking tight end Anthony Hill from NC State but unfortunately he was picked by the Texans about eight picks before the Cards in the 4th, so he’s off the board. The only other TE who was avaliable that I was interested in was Cornelius Ingram but the Cards obviously didn’t like him for whatever reason. As for Toler, everything I’ve read about him suggests that’s he’s basically a DRC-clone. With great size and tremendous athletic ability, the only real question seems to be can he handle the tremendous jump in competition. The luxury that the Cards have with him is that they won’t have to rush him into playing time considering that he’s probably the fourth or fifth corner (if you count Rolle as a corner in the nickel or dime) so he could be nothing more than a developmental pick. After all, Brown is plenty old and on a one year deal so it’s possible that Toler could be the nickel corner in 2010. Then McFadden is free after that season and maybe just maybe, Toler is ready to be a starter in his third season. So I can’t agrue too much with the pick…..a sheepish thumbs up!!

Round 5: See round 3

Round 6:
Ok the last two rounds are pretty dicey and I think at this point boards don’t really matter and your just trying to find someone with the talent to become a player in two or three years. Davis sounds more like the kind of DE/OLB convert that we’re used to considering that he’s a natural pass rusher who struggles to hold his ground against the run. He fell in the draft though because of a down senior year, but everyone agrees that he has the physical ability to be a player in the this league. Let him spend the next year and half with John Lott and we’ll see where he is next summer. I could argue for a ILB who went undrafted but oh well, at least I had the Cards taking a OLB in my mock with this pick. So I can’t argue with the pick….thumbs up Cards!!

Round 7: Ok, so this is were my beef with their draft starts. Everything I’ve read says that LaRod Stephens-Howling is a big time reach and we easily could have picked him up as an UDFA. So who would I have rather had…Any number of guys including ILB’s Darry Beckwith, Antonio Appleby, Dannelle Ellerbe or Frantz Joseph…RB’s Ian Johnson, Rashad Jennings, Kory Sheets, Marlon Lucky or Arian Foster and finally a couple of NT’s Chris Baker or Khalif Mitchell. Anyone one of those guys would have been a better pick in my opinion, but I’m guessing that the Cards might have been super impressed by LSH at Pitt’s pro day. As for Trevor Canfield, I’ve seem some rate him as high as a fourth round pick so I can’t argue with that pick at all. So I’m half arguing and half pleased with the round……half a thumbs up to the Cards???

Wow, that was super long so I won’t add anymore other than to say….Go Cards!!

by Bezekira on May 15, 2009 7:31 AM MDT reply actions  

I think this is nitpicking

I don’t mind the pick of R. Johnson at all, it’s a great pick for the future but he can contribute now. I don’t love the Toler pick and 10 years ago I would have written the same article as MBN. However, in the last couple years, the Cards drafting has been much, much better. I can give them some leeway with a 4th round pick, for now.

Basically I agree with this Round 7 analysis completely. I personally thought a ILB was a necessity and the value of Ian Johnson and Kory Sheets were fantastic. Stephens-Howling is a return guy. Is he better than anything else we have now? I hope he is, but I highly doubt it.

by KDean75 on May 15, 2009 8:01 AM MDT up reply actions  

+1

Who would win in a fight, Whisenhunt or a Hurricane?
Hold on, hold on, what if the Hurricanes name was Whisenhunt?
Daaaaaaaaaa Cards, Da Cards Da Cards Da Cards Da Cards!!!

by boogatt66 on May 15, 2009 11:30 AM MDT up reply actions  

I like these picks....

Greg Toler in my opinion is going to be the next Asante Samuel. He has all the tools to play just like him. Rashad Johnson is going to be a very good safety in this league and will add some depth to the position, already had decent depth but we didn’t really have a backup safety that could effectively play good coverage.

by Pyromnc on May 15, 2009 10:20 AM MDT reply actions  

The Cadinals won the Draft!

other teams did well, but the cardinals won.

The Dolphins came in 2nd place since they schooled the Redskins into giving up a 2nd round pick for Jason Taylor who is now back with their team anyway. ( That pick was used on Pat White!)

by CardsDefense on May 15, 2009 11:39 AM MDT reply actions  

I don't know...

I think that the Patriots and Packers had better drafts than the Cards and Fins. The Patriots got 4 very good players in the 2nd round and they got lots of extra picks for next year. The Packers might have gotten the best 2 defensive players in the draft. I think we are awfully close to having a better draft class then them though. :-)

by Pyromnc on May 15, 2009 12:35 PM MDT up reply actions  

Cards had a quiet but potential loud draft

I see 3 possibly 4 starters in the next few years out of this draft.
1) Chris Wells: due to his hype and the lack of depth at the RB position
2) Rashad Johnson: we could put Rolle back in at corner
3) Herman Johnson: has so much upside and with our oline he can fill a void
4) Cody Brown: with our aging LB’s and the cut of Laboy he could start next year

by azcardswinez on May 28, 2009 11:25 AM MDT reply actions  

don't sleep on Greg Toler either

McFadden is only here for two years and Brown will probably be retired by then. If Toler has the potential that they’re touting right now he could be a starter three years from now.

by Bezekira on May 28, 2009 11:34 AM MDT up reply actions  

+1

McFadden’s contract is just long enough to see if Toler can be the CB that they think he may be.

by AJ BirdWatcher on May 28, 2009 12:28 PM MDT up reply actions  

Correct!

I like Toller too, you bring a good point about mcfadden being here only 2 years and he could jump in, Ill give you that make it 5 potential starters from this years draft.

by azcardswinez on May 28, 2009 12:51 PM MDT reply actions  

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