3-4 NT and ILB and the Draft
After reading the good summary on the home page of a traditional 3-4 I thought I would add a few thoughts on the ILB and the NT. I think there are a few things to think about when looking at potential picks in the draft. I hear a lot of talk from all over about draft value and what the Cards should pick and honestly I wonder if they have ever seen the Cardinals play. The picks just do not fit the Cardinals. Sometimes we as fans fall into the same trap, and think that some LB would be a great pick because he is athletic. The better question is do they fit what we do, or are they so talented that the Cardinals should adjust what they do to fit some outstanding talent. Case in point: We know a classic 3-4 DE is tall and big. Campbell fits better than Dockett. But Davis has adjusted the 3-4 to fit Dockett. Watch on passing downs, Dockett moves over the guard and playes the 3 technique where he excels and that is why he gets sacks. They did the same with Dansby. He was poor against the run but good against the pass, so the adjusted. If a player is that talented you adjust, but I would think you would draft for the ideal. Here is a look at the NT and ILB in the 3-4.
NT: Weight is important but equally important is pad level and leverage. 340lb and 6-6 may not be a good NT if they are unable to keep thier pads low and maintain leverage against blocking. Think Alan Branch. That is why Robinson started. He wasn't the heaviest by a long stretch, he just could keep leverage better than the others. When looking at prospective draft NT think size but also leverage. Linval Joseph may not be a good NT because he is 6-5 but a 6-3 Williams is a stump inside even though he is only 327. Look at tape of Cody and watch his pad level for the first 5 seconds of the play. When he gets lazy his pads come up but when he is dominant he keeps his pads low. Then compare to Branch when he was at NT. He instantly stood up at the snap. Leverage! So who fits the Cardinals in the draft? Williams, Cody, Thomas, Troup, Ross, Udofia, Maybe Joseph.
ILB: I won't review the difference between the Mike and Will ILB. Davis likes to have the OLB not switch so they simply become left and right OLB. I think he would like to have the ILB not switch either. An ILB in a 3-4 lines up over the guard and has to deal with bulk inside more than MLB in a 4-3. Consequently he has to be bigger (as a rule) and good at gap reads. He regualrly has to fight through an interior lineman and sometimes a full back as well. Blazing speed is not traditonally needed on the 3-4 ILB because he has more help outside in contain and flows from the inside out to fill cut back gaps. There has to be a mentality about a 3-4 ILB where he likes the fighting and the contact in the box. That was Dansby's weakness. He avoided blocks intead of fighting through. Ali Highsmith is a weakside OLB in a 4-3. And that is why he ended up on the practice squad. Size, run stopper, with the ability to flow into pass zones. He doesn't have to be a good man-on-man guy across the field although Dansby was. So who fits this in the draft? McClain (he is such an ideal ILB it is almost sickening), Spikes (watch film and don't let his slow 40 throw you), Muckelroy (I really like his play), maybe Weatherspoon (go back and watch regular season tape on him. He is good but he sometimes did not work well in traffic and at 239 he is a little light), M. Johnson (a beast against the run 6-2 258), Eric Norwood (played both OLB and DE in college and never missed a game in 4 years), Butler, Dillard. Notice Lee and Washington are not on the list. Washington is talented but at 229 he is simply too light. Sure he might gain 15-20 pounds with Lott but in college he only played at 234 so you are running a risk and hoping he will get to a weight he has never played at before. Lee is an average 4-3 MLB. I actualy like Angerer over Lee. Angerer is faster and that would benefit on special teams, which is where I think both would end up playing their career.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Revenge of the Birds' (ROTB) editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of ROTB's editors.
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Before you discount
Washington the prevailing thought on him is that he could get to 240 without losing any speed and that amount of weight is something Lott could put on him pretty quickly. However, I don’t think he gets to #58 and I think he’s a reach at #26. I wouldn’t say that Weatherspoon is a little light for the scheme, either. Lawrence Timmons plays at 240. The biggest negatives to guys like Spikes and Johnson is that they’re more ideally suited to the strong side, which puts them behind Hayes so I would be more apt to draft Johnson in the later rounds than to go with Spikes in round 2 or 3. (I do think Johnson could be the steal of the draft if we get him in round 6)
All in all, good review. I like that you mentioned Eric Norwood because I think too many people only see him as an OLB, and I think he could play inside in the 3-4. Butler is another guy who should get more mention than he does, because he has the size, strength, and athletic ability to be very effective at the next level – would be a great pick at #58.
Washington
I agree about Washington IF you are confident he can easily put on 10 to 15 pounds. I trust the staff of the Cards. IF you feel he can play heavier and If he can put on weight, then he moves into mid 2nd round for me. I guess I hesitate a little with the IF. I would like to see someone at the weight I want them to play.
MBN
He's pretty lean
So I tend to agree that adding another 10-15 pounds on his frame shouldn’t be that big of a challenge for Lott.
He’s obviously a weak-side ILB in a 3-4 scheme, but his quickness and coverage ability would add a very needed dimension to our LB corp.
very thorough
thanks for the read. i saw we grabbed williams in our rotb mock, which i’m surprised to see only because some draft boards had him as a top 15 pick. hey if it happens, I would be happy with that or cody, but I’m curious what the bigger need is for an immediate impact player, NT or ILB? I know in our system rookies get time to develop, but you never know what can happen throughout the season and if one will be asked to contribute immediately or early on into the season… so it would be nice to add more depth with players that are NFL ready. I am just unsure who the most likely NFL ready player would be between the two big NTs and the available ILB pool after McClain…
To throw out a guess
I’d say Cody is the most NFL ready player (for us) due to him already playing in a 3-4. Williams will have to make the switch, and Weatherspoon would have to move inside.
Positional value
The positional value of an ILB isn’t among the top spots so the second round is a more likely place to pick one, even if they are among the best LBs. If you look at the projected grade for LB’s most of them land in the second or later unless they are pass rushers or exceptionally talented like Rolando McClain whose talent trumps his positional value.
NT is such a key position in the 3-4 that the position may out-value the talent to a degree, based on a supply and demand situation. Somewhere around half the defenses next year will be a 3-4 or transitioning into a 3-4. A paucity of college teams run the 3-4 so predicting who will successfully fit as a NT is a bit more of a crap shoot than many other positions. Hence the interest in Terrance Cody whom actually did play NT in college.
Whichever way we go, neither should be pressed into full-time duty before they're comfortable
Any NT will start in a rotation w/ Watson and possibly Dykes (he’s still around right?). As for ILB, they’ll play behind Lenon for a while. Players that will have to transition to a new position won’t be as much of a disadvantage.
Great post.
I don’t know who you are, but this is probably the best post regarding DT/ILB that I’ve seen here. Good job.

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