Bench Kevin Kolb For John Skelton? Hold On, Please
by Jess Root on Nov 2, 2011 1:00 PM MDT
in General Arizona Cardinals News
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PrintWith the 1-6 start to the season, it is understandable that we as Cardinals fans be upset. Kevin Kolb hasn't been the difference maker many hoped and thought he would be. It turns out that the Cardinals' issues run more deeply than at the quarterback position. But the sentiment that is beginning to be felt that Kolb should be put on the bench is really out of line so far.
Of course, we know that with Kolb currently suffering from turf toe, there is a real possibility that Skelton could start on Sunday against the St. Louis Rams. But before we get all excited about that let us look at Skelton's body of work so far.
The stat has been cited that Skelton has won more games than Kolb in less starts.
Let's look at that 2-2 record.
Skelton beat the 2010 Denver Broncos. Do you remember them? They were awful. And Skelton didn't beat them. It was Jay Feely and Tim Hightower. The other game he won was a thrilling win. But he had to lead the team down the field for a game-winning field goal against the Dallas Cowboys -- who had played most the game with their third-string quarterback playing. Tony Romo was out for the season and backup John Kitna was knocked out of the game. Skelton squeaked out a victory against a third-stringer.
Let us also not forget he started the game against the Carolina Panthers, who logged their second of their two season wins in that game, beating Skelton and the Cardinals.
Skelton, in his playing time last year, completed LESS THAN 50 PERCENT OF HIS PASSES (yes, I just yelled that). His rating was 62.8. This was with the offense being simplified for him.
Skelton almost did not win the number two quarterback job this year. Rich Bartel almost beat him out.
Now, I am not trying to say that Skelton is a terrible player. But there is absolutely no evidence at all that would indicate that he would be better than Kolb.
He has great physical tools and has looked poised. But he is still a long-term developmental player.
John Skelton could beat the St. Louis Rams on Sunday, giving him three victories in his career. But that would still be just a win over a 1-6 team.
Kevin Kolb needs to play. The team has to ride out the decision it made to go with him. There is evidence that he will turn out to be okay -- even pretty good. The record now is bad, but they had the ball at the end of the game three times with a shot to go get a victory and a fourth time when they had a lead and the ball and could have put it away. The have been right there.
To pull the car over and change drivers now would be premature.
The only reason John Skelton should start is Kolb's health. It is plain and simple. That is just the way it needs to be.
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If Kolb is unable to play due to injury
Let Skelton play. Otherwise, Kolb is the starter. I don’t think he’s been very good this year, and was opposed to the trade from the start, but I want to see how Kolb does with a full season, off season, OTAs, training camp under his belt before I write him off. Until then, i will accept his flashes of strong ability, his flashes of inexperience, and his sometimes extended mediocrity.
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by robloosli on Nov 2, 2011 1:20 PM MDT reply actions 3 recs
Completely agreed
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by JoeCB1991 on Nov 2, 2011 2:18 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions
In addition...
I want to see what he can do with two tackles that can block somebody. That is the reason the Cards offense is so up and down. Even we Kolb gets a few seconds to throw he’s so nervous that his fundamentals slip. If he had two tackles that could block he’d be a lot more comfortable and the plays would have time to develop.
Fire Rod Graves or sign two solid tackles with Levi’s inflated, underserved salary. That’s how the Cards come back. The D will learn and the young guys will develop.
If Kolb health he plays and If he not you play Skelton. That just how it is.
There nothing any of these two QB have done that say one is better then the other.
I feel Skelton has far more talent then Kolb and the only thing Kolb does better is understand NFL offense and defense but I’m starting to question that one.
by McCollum, Travis on Nov 2, 2011 1:22 PM MDT reply actions
Well let's just compare potential.
Skelton>Kolb
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SKELTON
i think we should make the changefrom kolb to skelton … and not because we want skelton to be #1 but so we could give skelton some game time .. we want kolb to completely understand" O" next season keep him healthy because one tends to try to do to much when in a losing streak and we cant afford any major injuries … if we sit him now we get skelton game time experience… cardinals benfit from a healthy starting qb and we just seasoned a some what rookie for next season … im not saying to blow the rest of season off but plan for future …….
I agree but...
We should do what we did in the Preseason. Play all 3 of our QB’s behind all of our other starters that way they all get playing time and they all develop chemistry with their WR’s and RB’s. Just what I would do.
Formerly Known as NFLNewsFirst
Skelton, in his playing time last year, completed LESS THAN 50 PERCENT OF HIS PASSES (yes, I just yelled that). His rating was 62.8. This was with the offense being simplified for him
He was also a 5th round rookie selection that had never taken a snap with the first team until about 2-3 dasys before his first start. He was not helped by the fact he was playing on a team that had given up. Look at the drops late last season, look at the horror protection, Skelton was tremendous given the circumstances last season.
Skelton almost did not win the number two quarterback job this year. Rich Bartel almost beat him out.
Skelton was injured in preaseson which gave Bartel more snaps (With Skelton out), and then as soon as he was healthy he was back in the #2 role. I don’t buy this.
The rest is fine, we have made our choice, the only reason Kolb will not go is if he is physically unable to go.
My biggest issues with Kolb is that ever since he has arrived in the league, last season, this season he has proven time and again he has not pocket presence at all.
The record now is bad, but they had the ball at the end of the game three times with a shot to go get a victory and a fourth time when they had a lead and the ball and could have put it away
The reason they have not been able to put it away is the QB has been unable to sustain drives late in games. Against the Redskins, Seahawks and Giants we scored 14 total points in the fourth quarter. None of those points coming in the final 5 minutes of the game.
Against the Skins we ran 5 plays in the 4th quarter, we benefitted from a massive blown coverage TD in that span too, Against Seattle we ran 26 plays, yet we were only able to maintain a 4.58 yards per play mark on those plays, Kolb turned it over once in that fourth quarter too. On the TD drie in the 4th vs the Giants we passed the ball once in 6 plays and gained 61 yards on 5 carries.
Kolb in fourth quarter this season Kolb has posted his worst QB rating of any quarter and has his lowest completion percentage of any quarter.
I have not seen anything that tell me Kolb is going to get any better than he is right now. He just does not have the pocket presence to stand in there and throw the ball, he is too scared of contact, and rolls out even when the pocket is clean. He refuses to step up in the pocket too. Just don’t see it.
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I agree with you khodder.
Jess, I think your being a little to hard on Skelton. He has shown great ability for pocket presence in which Kolb lacks, sure Skelton isn’t perfect and in some skills he does lack compared to Kolb, but he was a rookie. I also like what Bartel has shown in the preseason, the way he played (in preseason week 3 I believe?), looked like Tom Brady :P I know its against back ups, but still.
If you look at what Skelton was able to do against backups...
He was terrible. He had 3 picks with 1 TD and was knocked out of the game. Bartel should be number 2 at least for another season or so, so that Skelton can develop more. Kolb has the potential, he just needs good tackles, and another WR to throw to. Doucet is good but only in the Redzone. We need someone to stretch the field and we don’t have that man. At least no one has shown it yet.
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I don't recall him throwing any picks in the preseason
Only person who did was Bartel in the Denver game
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by JoeCB1991 on Nov 2, 2011 2:20 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions
He threw one that I know of in the Green Bay game which ended a pretty good drive. The other two I was told about. Sorry
Formerly Known as NFLNewsFirst
No that was Bartel, I remember that throw now. Horrible pass.
Here is Skelton’s preseason game log.
6 of 10 for 94 and a TD against the Raiders
3 of 7 for 39 against the Packers, also suffered his ankle injury during his 2nd drive.
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Sorry about that.
Someone told me Skeltons “stats” I’ll look them up myself next time. Thanks for the correction.
Formerly Known as NFLNewsFirst
Kolb doesn't have it,
and if you give any average QB what you listed they’ll make a pro bowl…See one of our previous signal callers time in Cleveland.
Formerly known as Cardsfan928, If you wanna grab a quick game of madden, my screenname is also my Xbox name.
And guess what...
He had these last year and couldn’t get it done. In fact he, Hall, and Skelton combined barely had more passing TD’s and Passing yards than Kolb has. It may come down to wins and Losses but Kolb has been the most efficient QB we have had since Kurt Warner.
Formerly Known as NFLNewsFirst
LoL,
1.5 seasons, sure is a long time
Formerly known as Cardsfan928, If you wanna grab a quick game of madden, my screenname is also my Xbox name.
Kolb has played half a season as well.
And has had less time with the team than all of them. They had an offseason and OTA and a full training camp. Kolb has had none of these.
Formerly Known as NFLNewsFirst
If his stats and the team's record
is well then you need to raise the bar on your standards.
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by INSOMAN1ATIC on Nov 2, 2011 10:54 PM MDT up reply actions
I don't think that post was trying to say Kolbs numbers and record are "well" right now.
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The game against the Redskins was not his fault nor the game against the Giants
Our Defence was dominated in the final 5 minutes in both those games. In the Redskins game he put together good passes but the Drive died when Chansi Stuckey fumbled the ball. The Giants game was a lack of playcall in the final 5 minutes. I know you’re a Kolb hater but give the man a chance. He’s taking snaps behind one of the worst O lines in the NFL. Every QB needs time to adjust to their new system. He only came in 2 months ago. Whisenhunt should have adapted to him which he tried to do when he brought in King and Heap, but with Heap plagued by injury thus far he hasn’t had one of the most dangerous TE’s in the league.
Formerly Known as NFLNewsFirst
I am not a Kolb hater, I just don’t know what this staff was thinking when they traded for him. Actually I do, they were thinking about their own jobs, they were desperate, they needed to make a move and they paniced. Panic is a familiar theme with this coaching staff.
Our tackles suck, but our interior protection has been good, a lot of the pressure on Kolb has been self created. Rolling out and allowing the pressure to come from elsewhere while cutting his throwing options in half. cotinuning to drop back rather than stepping up. Those are Quarterback issues, and those are unrealated to coming into a new system, those are things you should be taught in high school.
Heap and most dangerous TE’s in the NFL should not be used in the same sentence unless less divided by is not. He is good, but not great, but it has not mattered Kolb has missed him and Housler with throws a QB should be able to make in his sleep.
Yes our D struggled vs Washington, but in the Giants game the team had the lead 27-24 and the football with 3:37 left in the game, Kolb was unable to convert a 3rd and 4. He then took a bad sack on a 2nd and 1 (Why the hell we were passing is another matter alltogether) and could not convert a 4th and 2. Kolb had multiple chances to step up and put the team on his back in the 4th quarter and failed to do so.
I am not advocating for a change at the QB spot midseason becasue we have committed to Kolb. I am questioning the idiocy in our front office and coaching staff that has led to the commitment to Kolb.
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Don't forget that bad call by the refs on the Victor Cruz play
I’m not forgetting about that for a long time…
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the 3rd and 4 play was not his fault. Wells was averaging 4 yards per carry in the game and Miller put the load on Kolb.
Heap suffers injuries but he is the Baltimore Leader for Receiving TE’s and that’s a feat for any team. He’s a dangerous player when he is healthy.
Formerly Known as NFLNewsFirst
Our defense gets dominated,
because they spend most of the game on the field, due to an inability to sustain drives by the offense.
Formerly known as Cardsfan928, If you wanna grab a quick game of madden, my screenname is also my Xbox name.
That's not what we've seen over the last few games. The defense has given up big plays even when they get a breather
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Totally agree,
Skelton was supposed to be a project from the get go, and his limited appearance this preseason the kid showed way more poise under pressure than Kolb has all season, it’s time to shake it up because like all Cardinals fans, nobody likes 1-6. Not to mention from a physical standpoint Kolb is even in Skelton’s league.
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^not^
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During camp when Skelton was healthy
there was a lot of talk as to whether he would even be number two.
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Well Bartel
lit it up in the preseason of course there was talk about it, but once he was healthy again he was boosted right back up to 2 on the depth chart.
Formerly known as Cardsfan928, If you wanna grab a quick game of madden, my screenname is also my Xbox name.
I agree that Kolb should start
But if it becomes a blowout, just for the heck of it, throw Skelton in. That’s all I’m asking.
And at this point, I’m not sure if I’d rather win or lose. Halfway through the season, no hope for the Playoffs, I’m starting to look to the Draft.
Joe Saunders: "They played a really good game, so hats off to us"
Agreed there
Something like what we did in week 17 last year with Bartel could also be done with Skelton. Go with Kolb for a half or three quarters, and let Skelton finish off the game.
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I'm talking about the last game of the season with that by the way
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I'm okay with that
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Sit Kolb..
…he deserves a seat and the injury is a great opportunity to provide “cover” for the decision. Both Scott Mitchell and Matt Schaub missed games in their first year, and came back strong in their second year. It would be a nice change of pace to see someone that can execute a screen pass.
Great point
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It doesn't matter who is running the offense
We can never run screen passes.
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It blows my mind how we can NEVER get screen passes down
It isn’t like it’s a difficult play to execute. Also, it makes me really frustrated at how this team uses LSH. Give him more touches in space please! He is so fast and just makes plays flat out…. He should be the Darren Sproles, Reggie Bush type player for us.
Another thing since you touched on
If Skelton wins it will be against a 1-6 team, how about when Kolb let the previously plunderous Vikings embarass him earlier this season? Kolb apologists can go into details all they want, but the bottom line is 1-6 is hardly an improvement from last season.
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